Bilge Arslan
Yale-NUS College
Singapore (1.3° N, 103.8° E)

featuring Lissa Glasgo, Manager, IRIS+/IMM, The Global Impact Investment Network, New York (40.7° N, 74.0° W)

There are numerous social enterprises all around the world that strive to make the world a better place. I have always wondered how to measure the impact of their social work in addressing various social problems. Lissa Glasgo is involved with a relatively new industry that deals with this question called impact investment. Lissa’s nonlinear path that carried her to this sector makes her story even more interesting to me as I still currently explore many different fields in a liberal arts college.

Lissa Glasgo is a manager of IRIS+/Impact Measurement and Management (IMM) at the Global Impact Investing Networks (GIIN). In this role, she builds tools to help impact investors assess the impact of their investments in social and environmental enterprises. As a part of this nonprofit organization, she is responsible for building IRIS+, which is the generally accepted system for measuring, managing, and optimizing impact for impact investments. Lissa found impact investing by surprise—she graduated from Rice University in 2010 with a bachelor of arts in English. After college, she joined the Peace Corps, a US government program, and had the chance to live in Benin in West Africa for two years, where she taught English and engaged with girls empowerment projects. This experience was very transformative for Lissa in that when she returned to the US, she decided to explore the international development field instead of journalism. That is why she conducted research related to sexual and reproductive health and gender roles at the Institute for Reproductive Health, Georgetown University. Then, because Lissa wanted to work with social enterprises, she attended Yale University and earned a master’s degree in global affairs in 2017. This allowed her to get familiar with social enterprises, which then led to her current position at the GIIN.

Even from a very early age, Lissa was exposed to very different environments and meeting people from diverse backgrounds. This is because her father was in the military, and they had to move frequently when she was growing up. She talked about the formative impact of the Peace Corps, which fundamentally changed the course of her career path. “They taught me basic French in nine weeks and they sent me into my village to figure out a whole new life. And I think that was really formative,” she said. Building on this experience, she provided a very valuable insight: “If you’re going to work in impact investing, social enterprise, international development, anything that’s global and anything that has an impact focus, I would very strongly recommend living somewhere unfamiliar to you for an extended period of time. It makes your work better and you as a human better.” I agree with this advice, considering how moving to Singapore for college has been a truly eye-opening experience for me so far.

Talking to Lissa, I also explored impact investment as a potential sector I can try in the future. Impact investing will probably become more and more useful as the world faces many complex problems such as climate change and income inequality, Lissa explained. GIIN ensures that people who want to use their money to tackle some of these issues are making a positive impact. To this end, collecting and managing data has a key role. Lissa described what IRIS+ does by saying that they “want to make sure that as people are collecting more data, that it’s actually good data. And that they can use it effectively to make decisions.” Lissa works with a number of investors, social enterprises, and academics to examine possible investment opportunities in a particular space. Depending on the project, such as an agricultural investment or a clean energy project, different metrics are used. “It’s all about understanding what’s important and how we make sure we’re improving projects to make the best impact possible,” added Lissa. These make research and data analysis skills important for the impact investment sector. Lissa said that this is “a growing and evolving” industry and people from various backgrounds contribute to it by bringing in diverse perspectives.

Throughout the interview, I noticed that Lissa emphasized her nonlinear path, which encompasses a master’s degree in global affairs, and the merit in being open to exploring new fields and subjects at every stage of your life. As a global affairs major, I found this very exciting and relatable as I keep thinking about what kind of opportunities this field can offer me. Lissa’s journey also allows me to see that extracurricular life experiences outside of academics can be as significant as one’s focus area in college, both in discovering new passions and acquiring some soft skills that are useful in a career at a later stage. In light of this, my main takeaway from this interview with Lissa is the importance of being adventurous and courageous by creating occasions to get out of my comfort zone to see places, connect with people, and try to understand different lives by experiencing them on the ground. Only after we challenge ourselves enough are we really equipped to make a world a better place.

Highlights from the interview:

When did you first envision yourself as a part of this global impact investing network, or sector? Or have you ever envisioned yourself to be in this sector?

I don’t think that I really ever had a clear picture of where I would land in my career, and I think it’s still evolving, which is something that I wish somebody had told me when I was younger—that you don’t really have to have a plan, and that it’s almost more fun and sometimes more effective to just figure out what you’re interested in, figure out what you’re good at, and then jump for the next challenge that you see. I have found a lot of continuity in that, but I didn’t know impact investing existed until a couple of years ago. And I’m really happy in this field.

Did someone act as a mentor who helped cultivate your interests?

A lot of them over time. I found professors who encouraged me to do different things—to practice writing, to take a class that I wouldn’t have taken otherwise, or to study abroad. And then, when I was in Peace Corps, there were certainly people in my community and other Peace Corps volunteers that helped me test different ideas and understand a little bit better. And then bosses and mentors within jobs…I think it’s incredible the way that people are willing to give advice and coaching and help people who are a little bit further down on the ladder, and that’s something I want to do for other people as I advance.

What led you to your current position and what does this position entail?

It was a very nonlinear path, but one that I think makes sense in retrospect. In college, I studied English literature and wanted to be a journalist, but I also wanted to travel. So, after college, I joined Peace Corps, which is a US government program where you sign up for 27 months, just over two years, and they send you to a country…And they sent me to Benin in West Africa. I was there for two years. Being there and living in a village alone with people there, getting to know them, and teaching English, and doing girls empowerment projects, really changed what I wanted to do with my life.

And so, when I came back, instead of looking for jobs in journalism, I looked for jobs in international development. And I liked that a lot. I worked in an organization that did sexual and reproductive health and gender roles projects, and I learned a ton, both about managing a program and about research. And I really liked research in particular, but I decided that I didn’t like international development itself quite as much.

So, I went back to grad school with the intention of getting into social enterprise, which is a business that has a social or environmental goal. And I learned how to do research and learned a lot about social enterprises and then when I was looking for jobs afterward, I applied to a broader set of jobs, and ended up getting this job in the impact investing space. It was a surprise [to land in impact investing], but it makes sense because impact investing is the money that helps those social enterprises grow. And so, my role at the GIIN is really about helping those impact investors understand how to measure the impact of their investments of the social enterprises, and doing that in a way that relies on evidence that is not too difficult for the social enterprises themselves. My work is really about understanding if we’re doing what we’re saying when we’re saying that impact investing is making the world a better place. 

What are the skills that you find yourself utilizing the most?

Things that I think anybody uses in this field are the ability to manage a project and work with really diverse people. Since we are a global industry, it’s important that you’re able to communicate from afar and interact with people who are from different cultures. But then there’s just some really hard skills—like the ability to write well, to set up a project plan and follow it, and do really high-quality work. And then, for me, research skills are key because of the specific work that I do, so it’s important that I understand how to build a theory of change, how to select metrics and collect data and analyze data.

Just to get a more complete idea of the impact investing scene, can you give a brief example of the kind of projects you work on?

My role with the GIIN is to build IRIS+, which is the generally accepted system for measuring and managing impact, of impact investments. And what that means is that I work with a bunch of investors and social enterprises and academics to look at what evidence exists in a particular space. For example, in affordable housing or in smallholder agriculture—what is actually possible for us to do via investments in this space, and based on that, what are the core pieces of information that most people should be, or that most investments should be collecting? You may have different metrics if you’re looking in investment in a small farm in Rwanda, or in India, versus a clean energy project somewhere else. It is all about understanding how to measure, and then make decisions based on the information that you’re collecting.

Could you can describe the dynamics of a team that works on the project in terms of structure organization and other important characteristics?

The GIIN as a whole is about 32 people. Within that, there are a number of project teams. My team, which is the IRIS+ and Impact Measurement and Management team, is five people. It’s a relatively small team and we do a lot of work. What’s important for us is both a clear distribution of activities—it’s really important that I’m not stepping on anybody’s toes when I do my work—but then also a lot of trust. We have to communicate really well, and we have to trust that everybody else on the team is doing good work and that we can lean on them when we need to. 

What aspects of Global Impact Investing Network, such as company culture or support for professional growth, make it stand out as a great place to work?

The people are incredible. All of my colleagues are really smart and really driven. But it’s also one of the few places I’ve ever worked where there’s absolutely no competition. It’s very collaborative, it’s very supportive, which is an awesome thing, to be able to go to work and be able to rely on that. In terms of company culture, the GIIN has done a lot of work to support the staff—from having really good benefits to professional development. We have a certain amount of money allocated for each one of us for the year that I can use to take a class, or to do a certificate program, or to do some sort of seminar that allows me to learn something that will help further my abilities. They put a lot of emphasis on helping managers be really supportive, helping them learn how to give feedback really well, so that you feel like you’re constantly learning and constantly supported. 

How are science and technology reshaping the work you’re doing, and what changes do you foresee in your specific area?

There has never been more available data or easier ways of getting that data, I suppose. So now that much of the world has at least one mobile phone, it’s far more possible to send out a quick survey to all of the people who have purchased a product, who have gotten a loan, or something like that…I think you’ll see more and more data; that’s not always a good thing…it is possible to ask a bunch of questions that don’t add up to anything. I think what you see much of the industry doing is really trying to harmonize and to figure out what those key pieces of information are, and that’s what IRIS+ does, so that’s where I sit within the industry. We want to make sure that as people are collecting more data, that it’s actually good data. And that they can use it effectively to make decisions.

What do you think is the biggest issue facing your industry?

I feel quite optimistic about the industry as a whole. I think we have to maybe two things. One is that I think impact investing is poised to grow pretty rapidly in the next couple of years. I think we’ve seen lots and lots of big issues coming to bear like climate change, income inequality…And there seems to be more recognition than ever that impact investing can have a role in fixing some of those things to some degree. 

One challenge, or one potential challenge, is that we need to make sure that we’re not just—that the term is greenwashing or impact-washing. We want to make sure that as people are saying that they’re putting their money in something positive that that is actually proving true. And the way that you do that is measuring and managing impacts, of course. We need to make sure that it’s an expectation and a requirement that people are measuring and not just putting a pretty logo on something.

What advice would you give a student interested in your field?

Learn as much as you can about both the impact side and the financial side. I didn’t have a strong financial background before a few years ago, and I had to learn quickly when I got here. Classes covering economics and business would be useful, as would sociology or climate-related classes to get an understanding how impact can happen in different spaces.

Build the hard skills that you’ll need while at school, if you can—the basics, like writing well, using Microsoft Office suite, and managing a project…but then if you’re interested in impact measurement, you would also want to learn how to do data collection and analysis. 

What was your most memorable experience in your career that helped develop you as a person?

Joining the Peace Corps. I moved to Benin; they taught me basic French in nine weeks and they sent me into my village to figure out a whole new life. And I think that was really formative because it taught me a lot about the fact that people live very different lives, but that there are commonalities amongst us all. Career-wise, it completely shifted what I wanted to do, and also created a really fundamental belief in me that people are inherently generally good and generally are trying to do their best for their communities and the people around them (including me, when I was there). That belief has driven a lot of my interest and my motivation in working in international development and impact investing since then.

If you’re going to work in impact investing, social enterprise, international development, anything that’s global and anything that has an impact focus, I would very strongly recommend living somewhere unfamiliar to you for an extended period of time. It makes your work better and you as a human better—more empathetic, more aware of challenges and risks to projects you drive, and more connected to the impact we’re all trying to drive.

Interview excerpts have been lightly edited for clarity and readability and approved by the interviewee.